John Adams was our nation’s 2nd president & it seems in everything he get’s little to no credit. He was also our nation’s 1st Vice-President & he was, in my opinion the 1st president to steer us out of a war. (with the French) He is also considered to be perhaps the strongest voice in the Continental Congress for Independence & gave an impassioned speech & worked behind the scenes in those last hours before the vote to secure that Independence. In his keeping us out of war in 1799, he did so at his own peril, something we rarely if ever see today from our Politicians. A quick search reveals little in the way’s of memorials to this man who as I stated above was a “pillar” to our Revolution. Yes there is a Library of Congress building named after him, but not much else sadly….. On a website, someone recently wrote this about him:
“There would be no United States of America if not for the efforts and sacrifice of this great patriot! .. John Adams made two CRUCIAL decisions. It was he who nominated Thomas Jefferson to write the Declaration of Independence and it was he who nominated George Washington to lead our new continental Army“.
So, it seems to me that we could be recognizing this great contributor to our Nation in more ways then we do now.
Oh well more to come,
stay tuned,
Al
Tuesday, September 7, 2010
Monday, August 16, 2010
Outstanding article from Theologian Roger E. Olson
The problem with Calvinism is…
Posted on August 6, 2010 by Roger
People often ask me what is my single most serious problem with Calvinism. Why am I not a Calvinist? First, I like to point out that nobody is obligated to be one. Some evangelicals are under the mistaken impression that Calvinism is the norm for all evangelicalism and that if you’re not a Calvinist you’re somehow defectively evangelical. It is wrongly believed to be the default theology of authentic evangelicalism.
I grew up in the thick of evangelicalism–spiritually nurtured by mentors and peers in Youth for Christ where I rubbed shoulders with evangelicals of many different denominations. We used to debate Calvinism versus Arminianism all the time and we generally agreed to disagree and nevertheless worship and witness together. I don’t remember anyone then telling me I had to be a Calvinist to be a faithful Christian or an evangelical. I grew up in a Pentecostal denomination that was thoroughly Arminian (although no doubt some folks were really semi-Pelagian because they didn’t know any better and took songs like “The Savior is Waiting [to Enter Your Heart]” too literally. My uncle was president of our little denomination for 25 years–including the years I was growing up and becoming a theologian-wannabe. He and I talked endlessly about these issues and he told me that in the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) of which he was a national officer Calvinists and Arminians got along wonderfully and nobody made anyone else feel second class for holding either view. Point of trivia: One of the first presidents of the NAE who held office for many years was Billy Melvin, a minister of the Free Will Baptist denomination.
Then, something new began to come onto my radar screen. I’ll never forget the day in about 1985 when a student came to my office and said “Professor Olson, I’m sorry to tell you, but you’re not a Christian.” When I asked him why he said “Because you’re not a Calvinist.” He claimed that his pastor, a well-known Calvinist speaker and author, taught him that only Calvinists can be authentically Christian.
Later I had opportunity to talk with that pastor and he denied ever teaching that, but he did say to me that “Arminianism is on the precipice of heresy.” Over the intervening years something called the “young, restless, Reformed” movement has grown and many people associated with it do talk and act as if Calvinism and evangelical Christianity, if not simply Christianity itself, are necessarily linked such that non-Calvinists cannot really be authentically evangelical.
I invite representatives of the Reformed University Fellowship (RUF) to speak to my classes every year. One leader of the local chapter told my class “Oh, Arminianism–that’s just Pelagianism.” Of course, I corrected him, but I suspect he and many others like him still think that.
Calvinist and Arminian evangelicals share much common ground as I wrote in my book Arminian Theology: Myths and Realities. But, there are also deep differences. And that brings me back to the question why I am not a Calvinist.
As I implied above, first, I never was one and have never seen compelling reason to become one. It’s the same reason I am not an amillennialist (in spite of the fact that many of my evangelical peers in the theological guild are)–I grew up premillennial and I’ve never seen sufficient biblical evidence or heard or read sufficient arguments to make me change my mind. My premillennialism has evolved; it’s no longer of the dispensational variety. But I cherish the belief in a future, earthly messianic reign of peace, justice and prosperity. The German theologian Juergen Moltmann has become my main guide in this area of eschatology. He is a premillennialist with a difference (from, say, dispensational premillennialism of the Tim LaHaye variety).
Second, I am not a Calvinist because (hold on!) IF I WERE A CALVINIST I would have trouble distinguishing between God and the devil. Some Calvinists have misinterpreted this saying. They think I’m accusing them of worshiping the devil. Nothing could be farther from the truth. All I am saying is, if I were a Calvinist, being of the bent of mind that I am (striving for logical consistency as much as possible), I would have trouble clearly distinguishing between God and the devil in my own mind.
To my Calvinist acquaintances who take umbrage at this, all I can say is–please just consider it my own intellectual failure if you wish. I am not aiming this saying at you. I am admitting my own failure (from your point of view, I’m sure). But it does hold me back from joining the ranks of the “young, restless, Reformed” (not all of who are young, by the way).
The point is–God’s character. IF God elects people to salvation unconditionally and IF God IS love (1 John) why doesn’t he save everybody? IF I could be a universalist, I could be a Calvinist. I don’t care about free will for its own sake or for any humanist reasons. Hell is the sticky issue. The Calvinist God could save everyone because his election to salvation is unconditional and his grace is irresistible. Apparently, he purposefully chooses to “pass over” some (which is in effect the same as foreordaining them to hell). Why? For his glory? Some Calvinists say hell is necessary for the full manifestation of God’s attribute of justice. I ask what that says about the cross-was it not a sufficient manifestation of God’s justice?
The devil wants everyone to go to hell. The God of Calvinism wants many to go to hell. Is that enough of a difference of character? Not to me. The God of Jesus Christ is absolutely, unconditionally good. The God of Calvinism, from my perspective, is not absolutely, uncondtionally good and, in fact, has a dark side that includes willing that people perish eternally (contrary to 2 Peter 3:9 and 1 Timothy 2:4).
Next year Zondervan will publish my book-length explanation of what I see wrong with Calvinism. This is just a hint at that. But let me say here and now that, in spite of my serious qualms about Calvinism, I do consider Calvinists my fellow evangelicals. I would never say or suggest that someone is defectively evangelical because he or she is a Calvinist. What I think is that Calvinists are confused insofar as they believe God is love (as Scripture clearly says) and yet hold onto their belief in unconditional election, limited atonement and irresistible grace.
What really bothers me at a personal as well as professional level is the present, on-going attitude of superiority and even exclusiveness being fostered among many of the young, restless, Reformed Christians. It reminds me of the attitude displayed by many of the followers of Bill Gothard in the 1970s–they believed they had found the magical key that unlocked the secrets of true spirituality to the exclusion of those poor, ignorant folks who had not yet attended a Basic Youth Conflicts seminar.
I do NOT claim that Arminianism is the be-all and end-all of biblical, evangelical faith. It is one way of interpreting Scripture and, for now at least, I believe it is the most accurate way among all the known options. (One reason I believe that is that it is the closest Protestant theology to the soteriology–doctrine of salvation–among the Christians of the first four to five centuries. I don’t find anything like Calvinism appearing until Augustine in the early 5th century.) But I suspect “When we all get to heaven” (the title of a good old gospel song) we will all find out that our “little systems” fell short of the fullness of truth. As Alfred, Lord Tennyson wrote: “Our little systems have their day; they have their day and cease to be. They are but broken lights of Thee, and Thou, o God, art more than they.” We would all do well to take that to heart.
Posted on August 6, 2010 by Roger
People often ask me what is my single most serious problem with Calvinism. Why am I not a Calvinist? First, I like to point out that nobody is obligated to be one. Some evangelicals are under the mistaken impression that Calvinism is the norm for all evangelicalism and that if you’re not a Calvinist you’re somehow defectively evangelical. It is wrongly believed to be the default theology of authentic evangelicalism.
I grew up in the thick of evangelicalism–spiritually nurtured by mentors and peers in Youth for Christ where I rubbed shoulders with evangelicals of many different denominations. We used to debate Calvinism versus Arminianism all the time and we generally agreed to disagree and nevertheless worship and witness together. I don’t remember anyone then telling me I had to be a Calvinist to be a faithful Christian or an evangelical. I grew up in a Pentecostal denomination that was thoroughly Arminian (although no doubt some folks were really semi-Pelagian because they didn’t know any better and took songs like “The Savior is Waiting [to Enter Your Heart]” too literally. My uncle was president of our little denomination for 25 years–including the years I was growing up and becoming a theologian-wannabe. He and I talked endlessly about these issues and he told me that in the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) of which he was a national officer Calvinists and Arminians got along wonderfully and nobody made anyone else feel second class for holding either view. Point of trivia: One of the first presidents of the NAE who held office for many years was Billy Melvin, a minister of the Free Will Baptist denomination.
Then, something new began to come onto my radar screen. I’ll never forget the day in about 1985 when a student came to my office and said “Professor Olson, I’m sorry to tell you, but you’re not a Christian.” When I asked him why he said “Because you’re not a Calvinist.” He claimed that his pastor, a well-known Calvinist speaker and author, taught him that only Calvinists can be authentically Christian.
Later I had opportunity to talk with that pastor and he denied ever teaching that, but he did say to me that “Arminianism is on the precipice of heresy.” Over the intervening years something called the “young, restless, Reformed” movement has grown and many people associated with it do talk and act as if Calvinism and evangelical Christianity, if not simply Christianity itself, are necessarily linked such that non-Calvinists cannot really be authentically evangelical.
I invite representatives of the Reformed University Fellowship (RUF) to speak to my classes every year. One leader of the local chapter told my class “Oh, Arminianism–that’s just Pelagianism.” Of course, I corrected him, but I suspect he and many others like him still think that.
Calvinist and Arminian evangelicals share much common ground as I wrote in my book Arminian Theology: Myths and Realities. But, there are also deep differences. And that brings me back to the question why I am not a Calvinist.
As I implied above, first, I never was one and have never seen compelling reason to become one. It’s the same reason I am not an amillennialist (in spite of the fact that many of my evangelical peers in the theological guild are)–I grew up premillennial and I’ve never seen sufficient biblical evidence or heard or read sufficient arguments to make me change my mind. My premillennialism has evolved; it’s no longer of the dispensational variety. But I cherish the belief in a future, earthly messianic reign of peace, justice and prosperity. The German theologian Juergen Moltmann has become my main guide in this area of eschatology. He is a premillennialist with a difference (from, say, dispensational premillennialism of the Tim LaHaye variety).
Second, I am not a Calvinist because (hold on!) IF I WERE A CALVINIST I would have trouble distinguishing between God and the devil. Some Calvinists have misinterpreted this saying. They think I’m accusing them of worshiping the devil. Nothing could be farther from the truth. All I am saying is, if I were a Calvinist, being of the bent of mind that I am (striving for logical consistency as much as possible), I would have trouble clearly distinguishing between God and the devil in my own mind.
To my Calvinist acquaintances who take umbrage at this, all I can say is–please just consider it my own intellectual failure if you wish. I am not aiming this saying at you. I am admitting my own failure (from your point of view, I’m sure). But it does hold me back from joining the ranks of the “young, restless, Reformed” (not all of who are young, by the way).
The point is–God’s character. IF God elects people to salvation unconditionally and IF God IS love (1 John) why doesn’t he save everybody? IF I could be a universalist, I could be a Calvinist. I don’t care about free will for its own sake or for any humanist reasons. Hell is the sticky issue. The Calvinist God could save everyone because his election to salvation is unconditional and his grace is irresistible. Apparently, he purposefully chooses to “pass over” some (which is in effect the same as foreordaining them to hell). Why? For his glory? Some Calvinists say hell is necessary for the full manifestation of God’s attribute of justice. I ask what that says about the cross-was it not a sufficient manifestation of God’s justice?
The devil wants everyone to go to hell. The God of Calvinism wants many to go to hell. Is that enough of a difference of character? Not to me. The God of Jesus Christ is absolutely, unconditionally good. The God of Calvinism, from my perspective, is not absolutely, uncondtionally good and, in fact, has a dark side that includes willing that people perish eternally (contrary to 2 Peter 3:9 and 1 Timothy 2:4).
Next year Zondervan will publish my book-length explanation of what I see wrong with Calvinism. This is just a hint at that. But let me say here and now that, in spite of my serious qualms about Calvinism, I do consider Calvinists my fellow evangelicals. I would never say or suggest that someone is defectively evangelical because he or she is a Calvinist. What I think is that Calvinists are confused insofar as they believe God is love (as Scripture clearly says) and yet hold onto their belief in unconditional election, limited atonement and irresistible grace.
What really bothers me at a personal as well as professional level is the present, on-going attitude of superiority and even exclusiveness being fostered among many of the young, restless, Reformed Christians. It reminds me of the attitude displayed by many of the followers of Bill Gothard in the 1970s–they believed they had found the magical key that unlocked the secrets of true spirituality to the exclusion of those poor, ignorant folks who had not yet attended a Basic Youth Conflicts seminar.
I do NOT claim that Arminianism is the be-all and end-all of biblical, evangelical faith. It is one way of interpreting Scripture and, for now at least, I believe it is the most accurate way among all the known options. (One reason I believe that is that it is the closest Protestant theology to the soteriology–doctrine of salvation–among the Christians of the first four to five centuries. I don’t find anything like Calvinism appearing until Augustine in the early 5th century.) But I suspect “When we all get to heaven” (the title of a good old gospel song) we will all find out that our “little systems” fell short of the fullness of truth. As Alfred, Lord Tennyson wrote: “Our little systems have their day; they have their day and cease to be. They are but broken lights of Thee, and Thou, o God, art more than they.” We would all do well to take that to heart.
Tuesday, August 3, 2010
Associating God with Evil (Part 3)
Hello Friends,
In this portion I would like to look at how God "turns the tide" if you will on evil & ends up using it for His glory as He does all things eventually. I am reminded right away of Joseph who was sold into slavery in Egypt by his brothers. It was truly a wicked and evil thing that they did to him, but when a famine had hit & his brothers showed up looking for goods & Joseph saw them, after awhile he made a remarkable statement to them about who our God is! In Gen.50:20 Joseph said to his brothers about what they had done: "As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive. Wow! He really is the God who turns the tide friends! I also think of the women Dorcas in Joppa in the book of Acts who died & then God used Peter to raise her back to life (I firmly believe we are capable of doing these same things today & I point the finger at me why they don't happen as they did then!) and the Scripture states when she arose again, many believed so God used her death & resurrection to bring many to Him, so God used the circumstance of death! May we have the faith of Peter for this day to, as the Scriptures clearly state "perform signs & wonders for they will follow them (us!) that believe, amen! And of course the ultimate use of evil by satan for God's glory was the Cross! Satan surely thought he had defeated Christ on that sad afternoon when Jesus was put to death, but 3 days later God took the pain & torture that Christ endured & totally tuned the tide on all the host of hell when Christ arose! So friends the Bible shows us that God can indeed use the evil in our lives and the sad & bad circumstances that happen to accomplish some good thing in us which is why James is able to say in Chapter 1 & verse 2 right out of the box "count it all joy my brothers when you fall into various trials". James knew that God can work in us that which he desires even through such things! And James goes further to say this in verses 13-15 of Chapter 1: Jas 1:13 "Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. 14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death". This makes it pretty clear that it is WE and not God who fall into sin & who create problems in our lives. Let it be known loud and clear that God is a good God! That he always wants the best for us & always has our best at heart & should he allow evil to befall us, He will in some way ultimately "turn that tide" friends if we allow Him too.
In this portion I would like to look at how God "turns the tide" if you will on evil & ends up using it for His glory as He does all things eventually. I am reminded right away of Joseph who was sold into slavery in Egypt by his brothers. It was truly a wicked and evil thing that they did to him, but when a famine had hit & his brothers showed up looking for goods & Joseph saw them, after awhile he made a remarkable statement to them about who our God is! In Gen.50:20 Joseph said to his brothers about what they had done: "As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive. Wow! He really is the God who turns the tide friends! I also think of the women Dorcas in Joppa in the book of Acts who died & then God used Peter to raise her back to life (I firmly believe we are capable of doing these same things today & I point the finger at me why they don't happen as they did then!) and the Scripture states when she arose again, many believed so God used her death & resurrection to bring many to Him, so God used the circumstance of death! May we have the faith of Peter for this day to, as the Scriptures clearly state "perform signs & wonders for they will follow them (us!) that believe, amen! And of course the ultimate use of evil by satan for God's glory was the Cross! Satan surely thought he had defeated Christ on that sad afternoon when Jesus was put to death, but 3 days later God took the pain & torture that Christ endured & totally tuned the tide on all the host of hell when Christ arose! So friends the Bible shows us that God can indeed use the evil in our lives and the sad & bad circumstances that happen to accomplish some good thing in us which is why James is able to say in Chapter 1 & verse 2 right out of the box "count it all joy my brothers when you fall into various trials". James knew that God can work in us that which he desires even through such things! And James goes further to say this in verses 13-15 of Chapter 1: Jas 1:13 "Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. 14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death". This makes it pretty clear that it is WE and not God who fall into sin & who create problems in our lives. Let it be known loud and clear that God is a good God! That he always wants the best for us & always has our best at heart & should he allow evil to befall us, He will in some way ultimately "turn that tide" friends if we allow Him too.
Associating God with Evil (Part 2)
Hi Friends,
Okay, in picking up where I left off, I would like to share with you why I believe that there is a "flow" throughout the Scriptures that tell us that God should not be associated with evil, or be blamed as the cause, etc." One passage that leaps out in this regard is John 10:10a where Jesus states this concerning satan...."for the thief comes only to steal, kill & destroy". This clearly tells us friends that it is the enemy (satan) & not God who comes to steal from us, who comes to destroy us & who intimately seeks to kill us! Yet, so many times we hear people say that God is the cause of their problems....perhaps the reason behind that is this...."well if God is really that powerful & loving, then why doesn't He put an end to my problems".
Well I believe that is a fair question from a person who knows little or nothing about the Bible, don't you? It makes a lot of sense that if God is who He said He is, that He can take care of anything that befalls us. So this leads me to another point in this discussion....."why then does God allow evil?" Now there is a question for the ages! After all, at the end of all this, this is really the "heavy" question isn't it? Because most people I think realize & understand that God is good & that He always wants the best for us, but the best doesn't always happen, so clearly God is allowing some bad things to happen & so there lies that deep question of simply "why". I promise we will come back to that friends, but let's continue to look at why I believe God should not be associated as the cause or source of evil.
If we now go back to John 10 & read Jesus words right after 10:10a, He states "but I have come that you might have life & have it to the full". We also read this in 1 John 1:5: "that God is light & in Him there is NO darkness!" Now that is a pretty clear statement from John friends. In God there is NO darkness, is it a stretch to also say that in Him he can not produce darkness & thus would not have produced the fall of Man in Genesis? I think not! We are further told this by James in chapter 1:16-17: "that every good & perfect gift comes down from the Father of LIGHTS in whom there is no shadow of turning! V.16 tells us not to be deceived, so we must ask, not to be deceived of what? The very next verse tells us, that all that is good is from God, not evil! James is making the point clear that God is a God of light, not of darkness! This goes hand in hand with what we have also read from John friends. Today, we often hear these 2 mutually exclusive words together "God - dam". How did that happen? How did God get blamed for all this, how does He still get blamed for the bad things in life that happen? Now we will visit soon that God can & does use evil for good, this is clear & true, but because He uses something, does not make Him the author of it friends! Here is a statement made by a popular Reformed writer: "If God's chief end is to bring glory to His name and God does whatsoever He desires to do, then the existence of evil must be allowed and decreed by God ultimately bringing glory to his name" This continued phrase by Reformers "God does nothing, but for His glory, or similar statements like "God is all about His glory" must leave some who are examining the claims of Christianity to ponder if God is egotistical no? Scriptures like John 3:16-17 & Phil. 2:5-8 teach us that God is all about us & that we are to bring glory to His name, not the other way around friends! yes, I do believe that God does indeed seek His glory in all circumstances, but not the way some of these Reformers make it sound. For instance a passage like Isa. 43:7 which states: "Everyone who is called by My name, And whom I have created for My glory, Whom I have formed, even whom I have made." is taken to mean that God is only about His glory and yes He created us to have fellowship with Him and for us to glorify His Holy name, but I think this idea of God ONLY being about His glory is a bit out of context.....Now it is also a Biblical truth that God doesn't "share space", just as Jesus doesn't (Isa. 42:8, 48:11, Jn. 14:6) but I think this phrase can be dangerous........and other similar statements like "God is most glorified when".....the fact of the matter is this: The Bible does not clearly state exactly when God is most glorified! That is an assumption, but it is being stated as a fact & that my friends is also dangerous! Just my thoughts here. Okay, we can pick up talking about how God has used evil for good & does, while keeping in mind that satan is the author of death & evil. Satan, not God tempted Eve in the garden & caused mankind to fall! Jesus stated this in His heated discourse with the Pharisee's in John 8:44a "but you are of your father the devil, for he was a murderer from the beginning" showing us that satan is indeed death's author by bringing sin into the world & we know that sin leads to death. (Rom. 6:23)
Until Next Time,
Al
Associating God with Evil (part 1)
Hi Friends,
It has been awhile since I have written anything so I am glad to be back sharing here. My topic for the next few posts will be how for Centuries we have associated evil somehow with or to God. I am not sure how this all came about to be quite honest, but I think there is more than enough proof in God's Word to show us that God is not the author or purveyor of evil. Now that is not to say that God cannot or has not used evil to bring about some good in our lives, I think we'd all agree that He has & that He does! But the question I ask is this: "is God the cause of the evil, is He the source?" Some people I respectfully disagree with teach that God in some way "pre-ordained or set up" the Fall of Man in Genesis, but then in the same breath will state that God is also not the "author of sin", I say "how can both of those things be true?" You simply can't have it both ways! We know from the Genesis account that sin entered the world through the disobedience of BOTH Adam & Eve, so now we must ask, "what part if any, did God play in that?". When God created man, did He make us free moral agents, or are we able to exhibit choice, or maybe yet are we a sort of quasi-free moral agent having choice at certain times, etc? At least for me, this has never been a hard question based on the passages of Scripture we'll be looking at in my next post, but I would be interested in any thoughts anyone reading this may have? Last, I would also mention the tree in the midst of the garden of Eden, what did that tree represent? Could it of represented choice, was God giving mankind a freedom to choose by placing that tree there? Please give that some thought friends.
Until Next Time,
Al
Friday, October 30, 2009
1st Year in Virginia
Hi Friends,
Well we are just about at the one year mark since our arrival here in Forest, Va. just outside of Lynchburg. It's been an interesting year for sure! Many lessons learned in a short period of time I think? We have meet some really wonderful folks, people we will have a lifetime relationship with regardless of our future destinations... I think that for me, meeting different & unique people is maybe my favorite thing in life, not sure? I also realize I had a real naivety about people sadly. In short, they really are at heart pretty much the same wherever you go, are they not? After all my years in Sales Mgmt. and Ministry, you'd think I'd know that, but I guess I didn't....good lesson learned even at 50! The area is just beautiful, hard to describe, you kind of have to see it, those Peaks of Otter, especially when it snows & the tops are covered, the rolling hills, he peaceful pastures & so on, just a real beautiful place from a land perspective, as made by a New Englander! (lol) And what a historical place, if you love history, Virginia is certainly one of the places to go! Poplar Forest just down the road, Appomattox's Court House a short distance away & just so much history. In my next post I'll talk about the Spiritual sense I have gotten from this area. Lord knows it's is for sure a "Religious" area, but do people know truth? That cuts at the heart of it all, they have heard a lot, seen a lot, but do they really KNOW the truth? I'll save that for later friend!
Until Next Time,
Blessings, Al
Well we are just about at the one year mark since our arrival here in Forest, Va. just outside of Lynchburg. It's been an interesting year for sure! Many lessons learned in a short period of time I think? We have meet some really wonderful folks, people we will have a lifetime relationship with regardless of our future destinations... I think that for me, meeting different & unique people is maybe my favorite thing in life, not sure? I also realize I had a real naivety about people sadly. In short, they really are at heart pretty much the same wherever you go, are they not? After all my years in Sales Mgmt. and Ministry, you'd think I'd know that, but I guess I didn't....good lesson learned even at 50! The area is just beautiful, hard to describe, you kind of have to see it, those Peaks of Otter, especially when it snows & the tops are covered, the rolling hills, he peaceful pastures & so on, just a real beautiful place from a land perspective, as made by a New Englander! (lol) And what a historical place, if you love history, Virginia is certainly one of the places to go! Poplar Forest just down the road, Appomattox's Court House a short distance away & just so much history. In my next post I'll talk about the Spiritual sense I have gotten from this area. Lord knows it's is for sure a "Religious" area, but do people know truth? That cuts at the heart of it all, they have heard a lot, seen a lot, but do they really KNOW the truth? I'll save that for later friend!
Until Next Time,
Blessings, Al
Monday, January 12, 2009
Calvin / Arminian Viewpoints (Part IV - Final)
Okay friends,
this is my last post in this series and so we’ll discuss both the “I & P” in this discourse on this interesting, to say the least topic. Below is a reminder of what the “High or 5 point” Calvinism acronym “TULIP” stands for:
T……….the total depravity of Man
U……….unconditional election
L………..limited atonement
I…………irresistible grace
P………..perseverance of the saints
The “I” stands for irresistible grace. Some of you if you have been a Christian for awhile have probably heard the term “hound of heaven”. If you have, this means that when God wants ya, no matter you do, He is going to get you, you have no choice! Well this type of grace is sort of like that! Now it’s easy to get into semantics here by saying that if a person “fall’s away” who was once a believer, the high Calvinist would say “well he was never saved to being with, etc” and so I want to stay away from that line of argumentation because at the core of this “I” is can a human being resist the grace of God in ANY form? Because if a human cannot, it would seem to me that there cannot be such a thing as a free or freed will! And then of course as we continue to see the “linkage” between these letters, we can see the connection in that it is ONLY those whom God has called (the elect) that cannot resist His grace, so His grace is also not (according to the high Calvinist) for everyone, but only for the “elect". This is something the Arminian does not and cannot accept! Rather the Arminian states that God has laid out a “prevenient or preceding” grace to “whosoever will”, and thus working in harmony with this preceding grace, man then accepts the call from God, thus he has a will of his own and is not a “robot or helpless slave”. For it is God who puts out this grace and the call, but it is man who accepts or receives this call. John 1:12-13 beautifully says it this way: But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. Notice the word received and the that it was the will of God whom the Scripture tells us in 1 Tim. 2:4 “desires that all men be saved” We simply need to only look around us to see the evidence that there are multiple millions of people who are resisting God’s grace (in whatever form you want to call it!) all around us, thus the evidence is clear! However the high Calvinist would state that the reason this is so is because all these people are not of the “elect”!
I submit such a statement makes this doctrine even worse in that the only answer can be that God predestined all these people for Hell, I know that sounds harsh but there is NO other truthful answer friends! This is also something the Arminian cannot and does not accept. John 3:16 and especially 17 make it perfectly clear what “God’s plan for man” was and continues to be:
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. Amen and Amen, so be it!! Our God has laid out His plan and has done all that needed to be done in order for man to have salvation, all is in order except the forcing of man’s freed will. Now another topic that is weaved in here is the Sovereignty of God and what part that plays. In the future, I will address this in a separate post. Yes friends, there is an elect of God and I pray you are counted among them and in order to be among this elect, the answer is to open your heart to the Lord Jesus Christ today and let Him in! John chapter 3 also tells us what this can happen as well as Romans 10:9-10.
And now let us discuss the “P”, the perseverance of the Saints. This perseverance is also called “preservation” and I have already in a sense discussed in this my previous post entitled “Eternal Security” part 1. Here is a brief but succinct definition of what High Calvinism teaches here:
Perseverance (or preservation) of the saints is also known as "eternal security." The word saints is used in the Biblical sense to refer to all who are set apart by God, not in the technical sense of one who is exceptionally holy, canonized, or in heaven. The doctrine asserts that, since God is sovereign and his will cannot be frustrated by humans or anything else, those whom God has called into communion with himself will continue in faith until the end. Those who apparently fall away either never had true faith to begin with or will return. This doctrine is slightly different from the Free Grace or "once saved, always saved" view advocated by some evangelicals in which, despite apostasy or unrepentant and habitual sin, the individual is truly saved if he or she had truly accepted Christ at any point in the past; in traditional Calvinist teaching, apostasy by such a person may be proof that they never were saved.
One clear contradiction found in the above statement that a person who has fallen away, might return is when that is compared to Hebrews 6:4-6 which says:
For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. God states here that for such a person it simply is NOT possible for them to return, thus the only way the Calvinist can make sense out of this is to say that they were never saved to begin with or that they somehow can return. There is certainly a lot of Scripture to show us that the Christian life is indeed one of perseverance, but to say that God, because a person is somehow “elected” directly by him, can automatically make it through to the end in this life with all it’s troubles and hardships, is just not in keeping with so many passages that I have quoted throughout this study concerning the fact that we need to treat each day like it may be our last and that as 1 Corth. 15:58 states so emphatically: Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your toil is not in vain in the Lord. So while I agree we need to persevere, I do not believe that we have a “free” pass going through this life based on some special or invisible call made by God as I believe the high Calvinist would have us think. I, especially in this particular issue can quote Calvin himself who stated the following:
"the hearts of the godly are so effectually governed by the Spirit of God, that through an inflexible disposition they follow his guidance." (John Calvin)
"the power of the Spirit is so effectual, that it necessarily retains us in continual obedience to righteousness." (John Calvin)
The idea of God assuring one’s salvation just does not hold up in the whole of Scripture. We are not pawns placed in the hand of God, if that was what God wanted, I submit the “Tree” would never of been placed in the Garden of Eden, for in that tree was founded the very roots of a freed will and of choice!
Until Next Time,
Al
this is my last post in this series and so we’ll discuss both the “I & P” in this discourse on this interesting, to say the least topic. Below is a reminder of what the “High or 5 point” Calvinism acronym “TULIP” stands for:
T……….the total depravity of Man
U……….unconditional election
L………..limited atonement
I…………irresistible grace
P………..perseverance of the saints
The “I” stands for irresistible grace. Some of you if you have been a Christian for awhile have probably heard the term “hound of heaven”. If you have, this means that when God wants ya, no matter you do, He is going to get you, you have no choice! Well this type of grace is sort of like that! Now it’s easy to get into semantics here by saying that if a person “fall’s away” who was once a believer, the high Calvinist would say “well he was never saved to being with, etc” and so I want to stay away from that line of argumentation because at the core of this “I” is can a human being resist the grace of God in ANY form? Because if a human cannot, it would seem to me that there cannot be such a thing as a free or freed will! And then of course as we continue to see the “linkage” between these letters, we can see the connection in that it is ONLY those whom God has called (the elect) that cannot resist His grace, so His grace is also not (according to the high Calvinist) for everyone, but only for the “elect". This is something the Arminian does not and cannot accept! Rather the Arminian states that God has laid out a “prevenient or preceding” grace to “whosoever will”, and thus working in harmony with this preceding grace, man then accepts the call from God, thus he has a will of his own and is not a “robot or helpless slave”. For it is God who puts out this grace and the call, but it is man who accepts or receives this call. John 1:12-13 beautifully says it this way: But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. Notice the word received and the that it was the will of God whom the Scripture tells us in 1 Tim. 2:4 “desires that all men be saved” We simply need to only look around us to see the evidence that there are multiple millions of people who are resisting God’s grace (in whatever form you want to call it!) all around us, thus the evidence is clear! However the high Calvinist would state that the reason this is so is because all these people are not of the “elect”!
I submit such a statement makes this doctrine even worse in that the only answer can be that God predestined all these people for Hell, I know that sounds harsh but there is NO other truthful answer friends! This is also something the Arminian cannot and does not accept. John 3:16 and especially 17 make it perfectly clear what “God’s plan for man” was and continues to be:
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. Amen and Amen, so be it!! Our God has laid out His plan and has done all that needed to be done in order for man to have salvation, all is in order except the forcing of man’s freed will. Now another topic that is weaved in here is the Sovereignty of God and what part that plays. In the future, I will address this in a separate post. Yes friends, there is an elect of God and I pray you are counted among them and in order to be among this elect, the answer is to open your heart to the Lord Jesus Christ today and let Him in! John chapter 3 also tells us what this can happen as well as Romans 10:9-10.
And now let us discuss the “P”, the perseverance of the Saints. This perseverance is also called “preservation” and I have already in a sense discussed in this my previous post entitled “Eternal Security” part 1. Here is a brief but succinct definition of what High Calvinism teaches here:
Perseverance (or preservation) of the saints is also known as "eternal security." The word saints is used in the Biblical sense to refer to all who are set apart by God, not in the technical sense of one who is exceptionally holy, canonized, or in heaven. The doctrine asserts that, since God is sovereign and his will cannot be frustrated by humans or anything else, those whom God has called into communion with himself will continue in faith until the end. Those who apparently fall away either never had true faith to begin with or will return. This doctrine is slightly different from the Free Grace or "once saved, always saved" view advocated by some evangelicals in which, despite apostasy or unrepentant and habitual sin, the individual is truly saved if he or she had truly accepted Christ at any point in the past; in traditional Calvinist teaching, apostasy by such a person may be proof that they never were saved.
One clear contradiction found in the above statement that a person who has fallen away, might return is when that is compared to Hebrews 6:4-6 which says:
For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. God states here that for such a person it simply is NOT possible for them to return, thus the only way the Calvinist can make sense out of this is to say that they were never saved to begin with or that they somehow can return. There is certainly a lot of Scripture to show us that the Christian life is indeed one of perseverance, but to say that God, because a person is somehow “elected” directly by him, can automatically make it through to the end in this life with all it’s troubles and hardships, is just not in keeping with so many passages that I have quoted throughout this study concerning the fact that we need to treat each day like it may be our last and that as 1 Corth. 15:58 states so emphatically: Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your toil is not in vain in the Lord. So while I agree we need to persevere, I do not believe that we have a “free” pass going through this life based on some special or invisible call made by God as I believe the high Calvinist would have us think. I, especially in this particular issue can quote Calvin himself who stated the following:
"the hearts of the godly are so effectually governed by the Spirit of God, that through an inflexible disposition they follow his guidance." (John Calvin)
"the power of the Spirit is so effectual, that it necessarily retains us in continual obedience to righteousness." (John Calvin)
The idea of God assuring one’s salvation just does not hold up in the whole of Scripture. We are not pawns placed in the hand of God, if that was what God wanted, I submit the “Tree” would never of been placed in the Garden of Eden, for in that tree was founded the very roots of a freed will and of choice!
Until Next Time,
Al
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